Some observations that aren't particularly well developed but a start.
This is a scary wee vid. Some points though - some of their numbers are wrong. That's not to say that they haven't identified a trend. But they make a number of assertions that are just plain daft. A decline in population doesn't portend the end of a culture.
Right now in the world there's a conflict of visions about our possible futures. There's the neo-liberal vision of a world of unlimited growth - which, where necessary, may be fueled by immigration. That vision is well organized and has a political class doing its bidding.
But there are alternative visions of the future. Mine is not well organized and has no party machinery at its disposal. But it's worthy of consideration none-the-less. My vision is one of communities that have achieved a balance between the environment they inhabit and the resources necessary to maintain that culture.
In countries like the UK with large populations on a tiny land mass that means reducing population density. I believe less demand is a good thing, and that this is self evident. Folks have to find a way of life that is sustainable. Consumerism is not sustainable.
And yet our political masters argue the opposite. Mainly they use the argument that continued prosperity is predicated on increasing demand. Pension funds, we are told, require an ever increasing work force or they will go bust. You may lose your retirement income if we don't accept ever increasing numbers of immigrants.
But what kind of future is this? Imagine the UK with 75m, 100m, 140m? Life would become intolerable. Social dislocation is already present. Add to that environmental degradation, disease, poverty, the loss of privacy, liberty, and democratic control. That's where the UK is headed and that's more a nightmare than a vision.
England is deep trouble. I hope Scotland chooses a different path.
Rather sinister video - who made it? Smacks of BNP. A call to action? And do what, precisely? Gas chambers? It all has a rather dark déja vu to it.
Islam hasn't always been about repressive theocracy. When the Christians were burning down the libary at Alexandria, the Muslims were copying out the books - which is why we still have things like Euclid's Elements. Omar Khayyam was one of many Arab mathematicians whose work is still studied today. Most people will be familiar with his Rubaiyat, and its uncompromising atheism and anti-clericalism. And yet old Omar suffered no repercussions.
Theocratic and imperialist Islam has its own enemies within. There are secular forces at work, and I believe they will succeed. To demonise a whole culture as a threat to what we laughingly call 'Western Civilisation' hardly seems like a constructive response to militant theology - a problem which exists outside of Islam and much closer to home.
I find the video rather frightening, not for the 'threat' it describes, but for the threat such ill-considered nonsense is in it itself.
I think what was meant was a decline in the indigenous population scunnert, or at least that's the way I viewed it. The video was just that, a start but I thought it interesting enough to put up. It came via email from an Irish friend who I would have thought would have been the last person to concern himself with this as he's a supporter of immigration and multiculturalism. His email said he's still right in his views but the way in which successive governments, particularly this one, has handled both made him now realise perhaps there's no way back.
I do hope people have time to read your post scunnert.
Three reasons why the EU needs Turkey - a youthful population, a well-educated workforce and a big army. I can't think of any reason why Turkey needs the EU. I can't see the video though, Youtube is banned here.
A grovelling apology for my comment the other day. It wasn't Lady Foulkes but Lady Falconer who got her and her hubby helicoptered out of here. Lord Foulkes hasn't got around to suing so that's ok.
At least I didn't say it was Lady Falkender. I don't think they had helicopters then.
This video raised several questions. What is the actual message in the video? Is it favouring discriminating against Muslim immigrants? Is it favouring that Muslim immigrants should be repatriated? Is it favouring something more sinister?
The video, it seems, pre-supposes that Muslims will not be influenced by the culture of the country to which they have emigrated but will form enclaves of their own culture and not be absorbed into that country's society.
I've no idea who made it Vronsky but it came from someone I've known for many years along with his comments. I thought it worth posting for reasons of debate.
You may well be right that it has a BNP basis but the message, for me, is on track with my thinking.
True we need to resolve our own inner conflicts and stop our message of superiority but it's also true that Britain is losing in the 'faith' stakes.
Personally I don't think it is all ill-considered nonsense as there is firm evidence that Muslims do reproduce far more than we do. Look at many cities in England and see that Muslims are now the majority race which means of course, for fairness in a civilised society, their demands will be met before the demands of the minorities.
Interesting comment John, I hadn't looked at Turkey from your angle. Sorry I forgot Youtube doesn't work for you and I don't know what to do about that. I notice some bloggers seem to use another 'system' so I shall make enquiries from them and see what I can do in future.
Don't hold your breath though because I'm the least techy person you'll ever know.
Brownlie, that's why I posted it because it created questions for me. You're right, the message is obtuse and Vronsky may well be right in its origins.
Personally I don't think it is all ill-considered nonsense as there is firm evidence that Muslims do reproduce far more than we do.It's old, old stuff. When I was a kid, the story then was that the Irish catholics were going to out-reproduce us. We'd be swept out of our own country by a tidal wave of wee baby Tims. Well, that didn't happen, did it? I don't know what eventually averted that threatened cultural extinction, but if it was down to increased shagging among proddies, I must dolefully confess that I wasn't part of the glorious resistance, much as I tried.
Before that it was the Highlanders - encamped in the lowlands as political punishment and attended by all the same horrors - rampant (but marvellously endowed!) sexuality, lack of personal hygeine, physical ugliness. The tartan Mandingo.
My point is - can't you recognise the racial stereotyping? It's far from new, it has nothing of originality, it's the same old scary, stupid stuff. Negroes, Jews, Hielanmen, Catholics, Muslims, Gays, Free Thinkers, Commies. They're all out to get you! Woo!
You'll be telling us next that we're all going to die of Swine Flu.
However, subrosa, if you really think we should all be fucking harder and more often for a purer Scotland, just pass me along your telephone number. I will not shirk from my duty.
I never felt any threat from the Irish I have to admit. Perhaps it was because they always eventually went home to the Emerald Isle.
Indeed I do recognise the stereotyping and personally I don't feel threatened by anyone as I sit here in this geriatric paradise.
No I shan't be telling you we're all going to die of swine flu. Nor will I tell you we're all going to die of alcoholism although I have done my level best to contribute to our drink culture in the past. Sadly, as I get older it doesn't much appeal to me.
There you have it Vronsky. More sex and more reproduction that's the answer but of course none between those under 21.
Thank you for your kind offer. Unfortunately virility has never been a strong point in the characters of the men I've chosen in life, so my excitement has now been directed towards my new singing and dancing memory foam bed. It provides exercise without the hassle of sweat and the huffing and puffing. Also it remembers who I am and once you're over 60 that's quite a bonus!
SUBROSA - Please contact me if you have any ideas, stories or complaints: subrosa.blonde AT yahoo.co.uk Replace AT with the @ symbol. My profile can be viewed here.
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13 comments:
Some observations that aren't particularly well developed but a start.
This is a scary wee vid. Some points though - some of their numbers are wrong. That's not to say that they haven't identified a trend. But they make a number of assertions that are just plain daft. A decline in population doesn't portend the end of a culture.
Right now in the world there's a conflict of visions about our possible futures. There's the neo-liberal vision of a world of unlimited growth - which, where necessary, may be fueled by immigration. That vision is well organized and has a political class doing its bidding.
But there are alternative visions of the future. Mine is not well organized and has no party machinery at its disposal. But it's worthy of consideration none-the-less. My vision is one of communities that have achieved a balance between the environment they inhabit and the resources necessary to maintain that culture.
In countries like the UK with large populations on a tiny land mass that means reducing population density. I believe less demand is a good thing, and that this is self evident. Folks have to find a way of life that is sustainable. Consumerism is not sustainable.
And yet our political masters argue the opposite. Mainly they use the argument that continued prosperity is predicated on increasing demand. Pension funds, we are told, require an ever increasing work force or they will go bust. You may lose your retirement income if we don't accept ever increasing numbers of immigrants.
But what kind of future is this? Imagine the UK with 75m, 100m, 140m? Life would become intolerable. Social dislocation is already present. Add to that environmental degradation, disease, poverty, the loss of privacy, liberty, and democratic control. That's where the UK is headed and that's more a nightmare than a vision.
England is deep trouble. I hope Scotland chooses a different path.
It's nothing we didn't know but it's scary to see it spelt out so graphically. (I did my bit - 3 sons!) I've pinched it, thank you ;)
Rather sinister video - who made it? Smacks of BNP. A call to action? And do what, precisely? Gas chambers? It all has a rather dark déja vu to it.
Islam hasn't always been about repressive theocracy. When the Christians were burning down the libary at Alexandria, the Muslims were copying out the books - which is why we still have things like Euclid's Elements. Omar Khayyam was one of many Arab mathematicians whose work is still studied today. Most people will be familiar with his Rubaiyat, and its uncompromising atheism and anti-clericalism. And yet old Omar suffered no repercussions.
Theocratic and imperialist Islam has its own enemies within. There are secular forces at work, and I believe they will succeed. To demonise a whole culture as a threat to what we laughingly call 'Western Civilisation' hardly seems like a constructive response to militant theology - a problem which exists outside of Islam and much closer to home.
I find the video rather frightening, not for the 'threat' it describes, but for the threat such ill-considered nonsense is in it itself.
I think what was meant was a decline in the indigenous population scunnert, or at least that's the way I viewed it. The video was just that, a start but I thought it interesting enough to put up. It came via email from an Irish friend who I would have thought would have been the last person to concern himself with this as he's a supporter of immigration and multiculturalism. His email said he's still right in his views but the way in which successive governments, particularly this one, has handled both made him now realise perhaps there's no way back.
I do hope people have time to read your post scunnert.
I've done my bit GV and you're welcome.
Three reasons why the EU needs Turkey - a youthful population, a well-educated workforce and a big army. I can't think of any reason why Turkey needs the EU. I can't see the video though, Youtube is banned here.
A grovelling apology for my comment the other day. It wasn't Lady Foulkes but Lady Falconer who got her and her hubby helicoptered out of here. Lord Foulkes hasn't got around to suing so that's ok.
At least I didn't say it was Lady Falkender. I don't think they had helicopters then.
This video raised several questions. What is the actual message in the video? Is it favouring discriminating against Muslim immigrants? Is it favouring that Muslim immigrants should be repatriated? Is it favouring something more sinister?
The video, it seems, pre-supposes that Muslims will not be influenced by the culture of the country to which they have emigrated but will form enclaves of their own culture and not be absorbed into that country's society.
I've no idea who made it Vronsky but it came from someone I've known for many years along with his comments. I thought it worth posting for reasons of debate.
You may well be right that it has a BNP basis but the message, for me, is on track with my thinking.
True we need to resolve our own inner conflicts and stop our message of superiority but it's also true that Britain is losing in the 'faith' stakes.
Personally I don't think it is all ill-considered nonsense as there is firm evidence that Muslims do reproduce far more than we do. Look at many cities in England and see that Muslims are now the majority race which means of course, for fairness in a civilised society, their demands will be met before the demands of the minorities.
Am I explaining myself reasonably? I do hope so.
Interesting comment John, I hadn't looked at Turkey from your angle. Sorry I forgot Youtube doesn't work for you and I don't know what to do about that. I notice some bloggers seem to use another 'system' so I shall make enquiries from them and see what I can do in future.
Don't hold your breath though because I'm the least techy person you'll ever know.
subrosa: vimeo.com works.
Brownlie, that's why I posted it because it created questions for me. You're right, the message is obtuse and Vronsky may well be right in its origins.
Personally I don't think it is all ill-considered nonsense as there is firm evidence that Muslims do reproduce far more than we do.It's old, old stuff. When I was a kid, the story then was that the Irish catholics were going to out-reproduce us. We'd be swept out of our own country by a tidal wave of wee baby Tims. Well, that didn't happen, did it? I don't know what eventually averted that threatened cultural extinction, but if it was down to increased shagging among proddies, I must dolefully confess that I wasn't part of the glorious resistance, much as I tried.
Before that it was the Highlanders - encamped in the lowlands as political punishment and attended by all the same horrors - rampant (but marvellously endowed!) sexuality, lack of personal hygeine, physical ugliness. The tartan Mandingo.
My point is - can't you recognise the racial stereotyping? It's far from new, it has nothing of originality, it's the same old scary, stupid stuff. Negroes, Jews, Hielanmen, Catholics, Muslims, Gays, Free Thinkers, Commies. They're all out to get you! Woo!
You'll be telling us next that we're all going to die of Swine Flu.
However, subrosa, if you really think we should all be fucking harder and more often for a purer Scotland, just pass me along your telephone number. I will not shirk from my duty.
Splendid response Vronsky!
I never felt any threat from the Irish I have to admit. Perhaps it was because they always eventually went home to the Emerald Isle.
Indeed I do recognise the stereotyping and personally I don't feel threatened by anyone as I sit here in this geriatric paradise.
No I shan't be telling you we're all going to die of swine flu. Nor will I tell you we're all going to die of alcoholism although I have done my level best to contribute to our drink culture in the past. Sadly, as I get older it doesn't much appeal to me.
There you have it Vronsky. More sex and more reproduction that's the answer but of course none between those under 21.
Thank you for your kind offer. Unfortunately virility has never been a strong point in the characters of the men I've chosen in life, so my excitement has now been directed towards my new singing and dancing memory foam bed. It provides exercise without the hassle of sweat and the huffing and puffing. Also it remembers who I am and once you're over 60 that's quite a bonus!
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