Wednesday, 19 October 2011

English Independence


Tedious Trantrums' Wednesday morning post. (His latest blog post is excellent.)

Quite an diverse debate occurred on this blog after the post relating to the SNP and the likely timing of the referendum on independence. It’s a hot topic for sure and one which is already steeped in too much politicking by the Westminster gang. There is only one gang down in Westminster, the lie has them being three separate parties standing for different things. We all know they stand for the same things with the slightest of shades different. Number one of which is, of course, to get elected at any cost, saying anything at all which will make them electable then junk it as soon as they get in.

Whilst we are on the subject of being electable let’s be very clear on a very important issue. The Labour Party is a Unionist Party and has no interest at all in Scotland as a separate entity. Scotland is important to the Labour Party because it used to bring in a reliable and significant vote, which realised more seats in Westminster. For that reason alone the English should be complaining.

It is an on going mystery to me to try to understand why English people do not assert their Englishness, out with sport anyway. Why are the English not pressurising Call me Dave to stop kow towing to the EU, for goodness sake man! Stand up and do what most of the rest of the EU countries do. Do the bits that are acceptable and ignore the rest. What can they do? Sue you? You don’t have any money. No one has any money apart from the Chinese, Russians… complete the list with all the countries who used to be our enemies.

You English people owned the world or at least the bits which were worth
owning. You exploited what you discovered which, at the time, was the way things were done and now we see Call me Dave apologising for it now? Is Call me Dave English? Does he talk up England?

Mr Huhne, now there’s a man who knows nothing about being English. His intention is to see your beautiful landscape and gorgeous wee villages covered with pylons and windmills, whilst at the same time freezing your pensioners to death.

I am a huge fan of the English. I’ve worked all over England and have always enjoyed myself and enjoyed the areas I’ve worked in. I’m a big fan of London and have spent endless hours wandering around just enjoying the Englishness of it even although immigration has been huge. It’s not as good as Edinburgh though. Obviously.

It’s less of a thing for Scotland to want independence and also inevitable that it will happen. It’s more of a thing for England to gain independence. To get the confidence back that made England great. It should be Great England not Great Britain. I doubt you’d find many people in Scotland, Ireland and Wales who would describe themselves as British.

The tide is turning and events are overtaking the politicians. The latest polls show a majority of people in England supporting independence for Scotland. Why not? We cost you money. We are not the same people. We share a similar language as we do with Americans and Australians but we are all foreign to each other at the end of the day.

Stride forward England. Believe in yourselves. Have the confidence to be who you need to be. Ditch the doubters and whingers. Recognise being English as being at the pinnacle of the world, but you’ll have to shove us Scots off first and we fight dirty.


17 comments:

Woman on a Raft said...

It is an on going mystery to me to try to understand why English people do not assert their Englishness

I can explain that. The British identity was a container fashioned to contain the constituent identities of the UK, particularly the English one. It did so very successfully so that if you had asked someone generally until about twenty years ago "are you British or English" they would have been hard-put to decide which box to tick.

As Anon on my blog has pointed out, the essence of Englishness was that they did not need to signal it and rather disapproved of those who did. They still do. You can see this attitude illuminated by Kipling in Stalky and Co, where Stalky - quintessentially English - is very dusty indeed about crude displays of nationalism.

The devolution of Scotland and Wales was bound to fracture the British identity but that is only very recent and the older identity was very strong, held in much affection.

The English don't signal Englishness because they are not sure yet who they are and there has been a concerted attempt in the last decade to dilute that identity before they figure it out.

tris said...

I get a bit fed up with English moans about all the Celtic countries having parliaments and the English not having one ... and how they are subsidising everyone with their hard earned taxes, when they aren't and when in fact everyone subsidises London.

The reason that everyone else has a parliament and they don't, is that their parliament is and always has been, Westminster.

The UK was and still is England. That there are other nations around about it is not really of interest to most English people, and why should it be? Do most of us think a lot about Shetland, or Harris, or Benbecula?

There was (and still is) a Scottish Office, in the same way that there was an India Office or a Colonial Office. These territories were not part of the day to day business of parliament, and because of their peripheral nature, an office was set up to look after their affairs. To get them noticed, if only ever so briefly. There was no need for one for England. The main business of the parliament was to run England.

To give the English a parliament would to be to accept the Liberal Democrat 'federal' solution, which now they have become Tories, they seem to have ditched.

There would be a parliament for each of the countries/provinces and one which would look after federal issues, rather like Washington DC or Berlin.

In any case, if that is what the English want, then what have they done to achieve it. Is there a huge campaign? Do they petition parliament, do they march?

Thought not. Just whine.

Demetrius said...

Alas, the UK in not independent and nor is any part of it or for that matter other entities in the Atlantic Isles, Ireland has now realised that it lost what little it had recently. We are not just rats in our own sack, we are all small rats in the global sack. England can only have more say if it detachs itself from Westminster and London, which is essentially what Scottish "Independence" is about. In Scotland's case the idea is to be simply a more distinct bit of the global corporate racket.

J. R. Tomlin said...

Ok, warning. I am going to be mean about the English so if it bothers you, stop reading now.

Remember, I am an American. I started reading political issues because of my long-standing connections with Scotland, not because of any bad feeling (or feeling one way or the other, to be honest) about the English.

But then they got my attention. They whinge about how much Scotland gets. They use xenophobic and racist language about the Scots. They use blatant terms of abuse about nationalists.

And let's be honest here. This isn't the exception, it is the norm. Time after time. And do other English say, "hey, that's not acceptable"? No. This is acceptable behaviour if you are English.

And they whinge on and on about the West Lothian question and how unfair it is that they don't have an English parliament. I'd agree IF THEY WERE OUT WORKING FOR ONE! How many decades of work and campaigning did it take for Scotland to get one? And TWO referendums, both successful in spite of the underhanded business that declared the first to be lost. But did the Scots give up? No. They kept working to re-instate their own parliament.

How many English do you see doing that? Um? None? They much prefer repeating the lies about Scots being layabouts who live off the English dole.

Sorry. But they can't do much to me (unless Rosie would like to remove the post ;-) ) for saying the truth. I have utterly lost respect for the English because of their own rotten, lousy behaviour.

Crinkly & Ragged Arsed Philosophers said...

Tedious -England is already independent. It is only the country's that have been deceived into a false belief of dependency that are not.

Tedious Tantrums said...

Woman on Raft. Thanks for your observations which make perfect sense. The way the St Georges Flag has slowly come to the fore is like a kind of indicator. It's a step along the way. More way!!! Thanks.

Tedious Tantrums said...

Tris,
The UK and Britian = English. That's fine to a degree but can be a but of a pain. They have some way to go. It would be better if they started anytime soon since things may get taken out of their hands. It's better to make your own decisions rather than ending up having other people doing it for you. Thanks.

Tedious Tantrums said...

You're right Demetrius. I'm hoping that the new global warming is the EU. A sinking ship that'll hang around until the vested interests finally get the message (once the money runs out). Let's hope.

Tedious Tantrums said...

Well JRT there's always a value on hearing an outsiders view. It's interesting that the English and Scottish abuse of each other doesn't seem to be covered by equality, racial, politically correct rules etc. Hmmmmm...

We all have whingers within our ranks. I really appreciate your comments. Thanks.

Tedious Tantrums said...

Crinkly and Ragged. Very interesting observation thanks and smacks of truth. Does it also work with the UK and the EU?

J. R. Tomlin said...

Tedious Tantrums, you might *choose* to see it as mutual, but I have yet to see abuse of the English by a Scot on a forum (and on occasion it does happen) that another Scot doesn't call them on it as being inappropriate and xenophobic.

So no. I'm afraid that is not the case. It in no wise looks like "abuse of each other" and I suggest a reality check.

subrosa said...

Jeanne, I would never remove one of your comments as your opinions are a valued part of any discussion.

Crinkly & Ragged Arsed Philosophers said...

Tedious - nothing works when its introduction is based on lies and obfuscation. It then comes under the lexicon of seduction.

Anon said...

The area which suffers most from London rule is the North of England.

A recent report showed that there has been a 19% increase in the number of businesses in distress in the North East of England.

The same report showed a 4% DECREASE in the number of businesses in distress in Scotland.

(Guardian 17 October 2011 - Report by Begbies and Traynor)

- Aangirfan

Anon said...

The area which suffers most from London rule is the North of England.

A recent report showed that there has been a 19% increase in the number of businesses in distress in the North East of England.

The same report showed a 4% DECREASE in the number of businesses in distress in Scotland.

(Guardian 17 October 2011 - Report by Begbies and Traynor)

- Aangirfan

petem130 said...

Crinkly. Totally agree.As has been stated before "the truth is out there".

petem130 said...

Hi Anon. The NE has more in common with Scotland than England. Mind you I don't know how they would see that.

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