Today I've had two telephone calls and three emails. Yes I know that's far less than most of you but they all focused on one matter; all urged me to post about Cameron's and his bestest new friend Turkey. Just to enlighten you slightly, three of these friends had been involved in the Cypriot uprisings back in 1974 and all know more than most about Turkey, its history and its people than most of us. First hand knowledge is far superior to books written by standby observers.
I can understand their interest in David Cameron's sudden desire to have Turkey in the EU but what I don't comprehend is why is our Prime Minister is acting in this manner? The man is a Tory and not so long ago he promised a referendum on the EU, yet withdrew his promise within days - on a technicality if I remember. Now, he not only wants Turkey to be part of the EU, he's out on the world stage insisting they should be.
Has he forgotten Margaret Thatcher's cautious approach to the EU?
In 1988, she remarked, "We have not successfully rolled back the frontiers of the state in Britain, only to see them re-imposed at a European level, with a European super-state exercising a new dominance from Brussels".
It's not for me to explain the history of Turkey or the history of the Turkish application to join the EU, I'm sure you know it already. What I do wonder, and presently I have no answer, is why Cameron has made Turkey a priority visit. Is it this? I'm sure some of you will enlighten me and my friends.
OldRightie, a staunch Tory, compares his party's leader to Tony Blair. He's not wrong.
How many more people can this island hold and how many more can we financially support?
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23 comments:
Mr Cameron has just been to America.
America has always wanted Turkey to be in the EU.
Mr Cameron is suddenly Turkey’s best friend.
America is sick to the back teeth with Israel and it's awful prime Minister and teh way that they treat Gaza.
Mr Cameron has just called Gaza a prison camp to the horror of his right wing.
If you add that Mr Cameron was obsequious to the point of nausea about America being the senior partner, and that that was the way it had always been and that the Scottish Executive (sic) was just plain wrong, because Mr Obama said they were wrong... and wasn’t Mr Obama wearing a nice tie, and nice shoes and .....
Pattern emerging now?
The Tories are the most anti European party, yet they took the UK in to Europe and with a couple of exceptions have been the party that took the UK deeper and deeper into Europe. Mrs Thatcher may have talked about being cautious ... NO NO NO she bawled at these damned foreigners ...and then signed up for whatever that nice Mr Mitterrand told her was in our best interests. (‘He was very sexy much though one didn’t like him because he was French. But he was so much nicer than that crude german with whom one had to do business you know... and Ronnie was very keen that we should play a central role in the European Union....’ ) erm so that America could play a central role in the European Union I suspect.
Oh well, only 4 years and ....10 months to go....
Well said Tris and I couldn't agree more Rosa, have blogged it too and linked you and OR in,
Cameron is a traitor and deserves a comuppance very swiftly, I am hoping his party will throw him down in a putsch and go back to some real Tory values ( No Tris not the watered down sh*t you mention above , but real British values)
Otherwise F....(to polite to finish the phrase on the blog of such a lovely Lady, have said it elsewhere)
Wow... erm Thanks you for that nice compliment Indyanhat.
I think they should ditch him too. in favour of a leader who wants to be in power forever... and who has the good common sense to see that the best way to achieve that is to get rid of these pesky Scots that insist of voting Labour and dragging England down....
You see where I'm going on this one....:0)?
"Has he forgotten Margaret Thatcher's cautious approach to the EU?
In 1988, she remarked, "We have not successfully rolled back the frontiers of the state in Britain, only to see them re-imposed at a European level, with a European super-state exercising a new dominance from Brussels".
Indeed, but rather than hand the State, as in society and those paid to deliver our communal well-being, she sold it to the highest bidder.
Regards,
JohnB
Great comment Tris, many thanks. We can say what we like about Thatcher but she did stand up for Britain when on the world stage.
I see the pattern. Kind of saw the start of it last week. And of course, Dave's now off to butter up India to ask them how many of their qualified people should be allowed to come to Britain.
You couldn't make it up.
I'll come and read it shortly Indyan. Surely someone in the Tories will shout stop to him.
That would be an excellent solution Tris. I'm with you on that one - all the way.
Hello John, that may well be, but at least she didn't give it away.
Oh hello, here I am again taking the opposite tack (trust me).....I think Turkey should be in the EU as I'd rather have them in as a chum (helping to spread peace and light in the process) as being out and a resentful and prey to all sorts of unhelpful external pressures. Things like who comes here can be sorted, it's who we don't want to keep that's causing the main issues for me.
Oh hello Dram, good to see you. Don't you think chums can be too chummy? You know the kind of turning a blind eye chummy?
I understand your concerns about who we don't want to keep. My concerns involve finding them in the first place as nobody has any idea how many there are here.
Tris, I see where you want to go with that one but am not sure it will ever happen!
I'm in Wales and would love to say goodbye to all that and lets make our own laws etc but its not economically viable to do so and the political twats would be cap in hand straight to the EU rather than stand alone.
Like it or not we all are in this sh*t together!
Dram whilst it may be desirabke to have a 'good' islamic dominated country in the fold, you have to first find one...The trouble with the EU is everything becomes reduced to the lowest common denominator and I really do not think it a good idea to lower the bar as far as Turkey! therein lies certain oblivion of the way of life we had and wish to re-establish...
The US is worried about Turkeys increasingly anti-Israel posturing and about that country getting shakey about its cornerstone position on the south-east flank of NATO.
Hence following his visit to Washington Cameron suddenly becomes Turkeys best mate.
America sees Turkish membership of the EU as binding her closely to the west while in reality it would create a Trojan Horse for Moslem entryism not just for the 70million Turks themselves; Turkey is just one porous border away from Iraq, Iran and Syria, charming.
Its time the people of the UK woke up to the fact that its unionist politicians say one thing then practice the opposite when they get into power.
The majority of voters at the UK 2010 general election did not vote for the Tories and their Lib Dem chums to re-introduce right wing ideology again into governing the UK but here we are already with swinging cut, the effect of which will be borne by ordinary people in the main that go far beyond what is necessary to recover the economy.
The majority wanted the UK's relationship with the EU watered down and immigration restricted yet here we see Cameron hell-bent on more integration and immigration vis a vis Turkey.
If the Lib Dems had any spine at all they would get out of their unholy alliance with the Tories before it is too late.
The people of Scotland should also wake up to the fact that it is always going to be like this as long as we are governed by unionists at Westmonster.
Banned, much appreciate that explanation. It's a good summary of what I've read in the past day or so.
The word poodle springs to mind and Obama must be roaring with laughter. Who needs diplomats when the British PM is happy to trot round the globe doing it all for them?
I don't think the ConDems are introducing right-wing ideology M, their policies are little different to Labour, just a different style.
When will the folk of Scotland waken up I ask myself? Are our heads so buried in the sand?
"The man [Cameron] is a Tory "
That is where you made your mistake, madam.
He's actually some sort of left-centrist authoritarian EUrophile green, if that's not too many adjectives at once.
I sit corrected Weekend Yachtsman, you're right of course. No I don't think that's too many adjectives. I could add a few of my own.
Can't resist commenting on this one too.
Turkey is the west's strongest ally in the Middle East and has done much more than most European countries to support NATO and defend western interests. (Whether those interests should be supported is another matter of course).
That is why Cameron said: "I believe it's just wrong to say Turkey can guard the camp but not be allowed to sit inside the tent,"
However the Turkish people can fairly be described as even more eurosceptic than the Brits.
Whatever happens with EU membership, it is certainly the case that the rapid rate of Turkey's economic growth makes it a very important player not only in middle eastern markets but also in European markets.
It serves British interests to have a good relationship. Cameron's speech puts British companies in a better position to win new business partners in Turkey than French or German companies. And that was the intention.
As for Mr Cameron calling Gaza a prison camp. Why not? It is.
If Cameron has upset the Israelis, he will be replaced by David Miliband quite soon.
- Aangirfan
Aye K, it was a trade mission speech but way OTT as far as I'm concerned.
I was talking with someone yesterday about this and they said the UK government was proposing a ten year transition period before there was full freedom of movement for the Turks to settle and work here freely. They said this reminded them of the MPs who accepted the CFP because there was a 20 year delay before it destroyed our fishing fleet.
The perpetrators will be long gone.
Aangirfan, so I believe. You're the expert on that part of the world.
I wouldn’t worry about the Turkish hordes if I were you. If it came to a referendum I would bet the Turkish people would vote against EU membership. In many ways it would suit them better having access to European markets without the constraints of full membership. I think that is what they would like to see as an outcome.
From the point of view of the US and their UK allies it is essential that Turkey maintains their pro-western stance so they will do whatever they can to achieve that. The Turks know this of course and make the most of it.
But it’s all a game of diplomacy. It would only take one country to block Turkish membership of the EU. As it is, more than one EU country is opposed. France and Germany in particular are not keen. It may be therefore that, in addition to buttering up the Turks, David Cameron was having a bit of gentle fun winding up the French and the Germans.
The problem doesn't lie with the Turks K, but the decisions their politicians take.
In this country, if there was a referendum, I feel sure people would vote to opt out of the EU and have a similar agreement to Switzerland and Norway.
Because Germany has quite a large Turkish population, its politicians have a bit of a tight rope to walk and they can't afford to seem anti.
Cameron ought to be careful. Having fun at the expense of the two biggest players in the EU could well backfire. Watch this space.
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