I've been following the backlash from the Legg report on radio this week. Listening to the bleating and excuses, the 'it wisnae me I followed the rules' and Ann Widdecombe insisting Legg's retrospective changes are illegal. All this was completely boring.
Now 27 MPs are to be investigated by the Inland Revenue and I'm sure those involved are worried. I'd be worried too if I'd been found out after having defrauded the IR for, in some cases, years. Of course many will say they made an error, but we all know that the IR penalises the hoi polloi for errors. Will the same happen to our not so honourable MPs?
The commentators reactions are all similar - "Vote them out at the next election." Why are we allowing these people to stay in office for even one day once they have been found to have stolen from the public purse?
If they were employed in business they would be asked to clear their desk and then be accompanied to the front door never to return.
But we, their employers, can do nothing. Therefore, MPs who are thieves, continue to attend Westminster while they bide their time for the golden handshake and a pension which most people envy.
A small amount of our money should be spent on cardboard boxes and those MPs who have defrauded us should be given 10 minutes to leave the building complete with the knowledge that they will forfeit their golden handshake and pension rights.
Instead, this week saw the man who was responsible for overseeing the 'nice little earner' of MPs expenses made a Lord. It was a revolting sight seeing the main accomplice being feted and rewarded in this manner and there was nothing the public could do about it. He'll be Lord Whatsit forever, while struggling pensioners continue to do without warmth in their homes.
If just one political party declared a policy which supported immediate sacking of law-breaking MPs they'd be voted in without much competition. Labour and the tories won't consider such an action - will the libdems?
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I think most people would agree Subrosa but Labour MPs and Brown have too much personally to lose by calling an election. Personal loss is outweighing the need for democratic renewal in the minds of those who cna bring it about.
If every newspaper and blogger demanded an election and 1m people marched on Parliament I still don't think he would call one. But, I am not going to stop asking for one.
SR, I don't know whether you have read Hannan & Carswell's 'The Plan' but until we, the electorate, are in that position of complete 'local' freedom nothing will change. It is up to us to pressure MPs to let go the 'reins of power'.
I don't disagree with your sentiment, but if we are going to make these arguments we do at least need to make them factual.
Your comment about what would happen "in business" is not correct.
If a director were to use a loophole, or an overly lax expenses guideline to claim things outside of what they need for the task they would not be sacked and if you believe they would I can only presume you have little experience of such situations.
Indeed, if they had operated within the rules, even if those rules were absolute nonsense, they COULD NOT be sacked. If you tried, they'd be off to their lawyer to land you with a substantial "unfair dismissal" claim in very short order.
This emotive issue brings out these wild comparisons with the private sector a lot, but when interpreted correctly they are untrue.
To my mind the problem here was the fees office. Their job was to interpret the rules correctly and offer advice. If an MP had an amount cleared by them which should not have been cleared it is the fees office who have made the mistake.
You can argue about the morality of the MPs trying to make those claims (and I would), but the commentators are correct in that issue - if you think your MP is immoral VOTE THEM OUT.
(I do support Hannan and Carswells "Plan" including mid-term oppportunity to have an MP removed in the event of serious situations like this.)
Looks as though your system is fixed. Sad The UK's is not!
Generally agree with the original post, but also with what Steve is saying.
My problem with 'voting them out' though, is that there isn't anyone else to vote in. Vote one moral-less idiot out and they are just replaced by another one. I seriously question the motives of anyone who actually *wants* to be an MP.
What is needed is re-jigg of the entire political system. Voters are adults - they are capable of making decisions. It seems to me that one of the primary reasons we have the system we have is because coordinating the decision process of the populous would be expensive and difficult. That might have been true 200 years ago, but this is the 21st century - there's plenty of ways we could re-engage the voting public and allow them more direct access to decision making on a more regular basis.
Anyway, ended up slightly off topic, sorry.
Over in Canukistan it's just the same - if not worse. Successive governments have been found with their hands in the till but nothing is done. The other political parties bluster but don't push the issue as they know it will be their turn soon.
But over here they don't worry so much about expenses fiddling - that's kid's stuff. No - here they go the whole hog into systemic corruption. From Mulroney to Chretien to Martin - corruption was the name of the game. Sure it went on before and probably after - we just don't have the details yet.
My wife's grandfather - Ulster Scots - was proud that he worked for the Conservative party here in the twenties. His job was buying votes at two bucks a piece.
Different day - same shit.
It's such a pity we can't refuse to vote Dan until the rules in Parliament are the same as the rules they inflict upon us.
I would agree, there's no way the present bunch would call an election. Far too much self interest involved, but yes we should continue to keep calling for one.
I haven't read that as yet WfW, but it's on my list.
How do we pressure MPs to let go the reins? They've created a tidy little club over the decades and they're not going to close that easily.
Actually Steve I've quite a lot of experience of business having been self employed for some years.
What I was referring to in the post is those who have flipped homes (law breaking when no tax was paid), the chap who had all monies paid into a private joint account which isn't even registered at Companies House etc.
In business these people would be taken to court by the IR or the fraud squad and it would be for the courts to decide if they were guilty.
True there are some businesses who have criminals as directors, possibly most countries in the world have them but they're not completely untouchable - one day some of them will be brought to justice.
One of our problems in this country is that directors can be found guilty yet are still able to set up another company without too much trouble. I do know fraud squads spend a great deal of time on such cases.
The fees office - ah! One senior civil servant who worked in Westminster told me once the fees office was 99% junior clerical staff and 1% senior. That's worked well until now hasn't it.
I assure you my MP is certainly not immoral but there are plenty who are. There's a certain MP from Luton who hasn't been seen my anyone for months (after grabbing £22000 from the public for dry rot repairs), yet she continues to receive her MP salary. Would that happen in the private sector? Not in any of the businesses I know.
I must read the Plan. As soon as I'm able to read books again I will get started.
Nothing is fixed OR except birth, life and death. We can bring about change, it's just the apathy that annoys me at times.
Now you're talking Chris, that's what I would like to see - the entire system more equal and accountable.
MPs have become little more than middle men between their electorate and various government agencies and of course party gofers.
How many gave thought to the vote regards the war in Iraq? How many seriously asked their electorate's views?
How many have any serious doubts about Afghanistan? We don't know because they're all tied to their party's view and there are no individual thinkers left.
You weren't off topic, it was all relevant.
Aye scunnert, different suit - same shit right enough.
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