Firstly my thanks to Moridura as I missed this last night. His post is definitely worth reading. As he says the clip doesn't catch all Starkey's ravings and you can watch a repeat, plus the panel's reaction, on BBC channel 81 at 6pm on Saturday and it is on iPlayer now, right at the end.
Peter Curran (Moridura) says it all in his post, I have nothing more to add.
Posts
37 comments:
I will nip over to his blog Subrosa but i watched QTime last night and that man is a bigot but what amazes me is the reaction of the pannel, they just laughed when he slated the Scots, Welsh and N Irish, mind you before that Dumbydy told him to shut up.
The problem with Starkey is that he is trying to carve a niche for himself as a celebrity historian in an already crowded market.
In his own mind he seems to live in the period of his specialist subject, Henry VIII. The reality of living in the 21st century must be a source of constant disappointment for him and whilst not seeking to excuse his pathetic comments, I do think he should be more pitied than scorned.
David Starkey English conservative to the bone thats a toned down version of how conservatives feel about the rest of the U.K peoples........
Jim he may be stuck in the past but the English still believe him. Nobody in the whole hall rebuked him.
Subrosa,
Will watch online and submit a formal complaint to the EBC - I've done that before over the farce of a programme about St.Kilda patronisingly put together by British types talking down to us - which is why I don't pay the t.v. tax.
CD
I watched it and the audience gasped at his audacity - I do believe there were some boos as well! He sometimes talks sense but this time he was just trying to hog the limelight by going beyond the pale - he knew it would be reported. He's actually a pretty good historian; perhaps he should stick to that. We're not all like him!
Hang on, Subrosa, he was being ironic and his "ranting" was pure fun. Really, it was. Unlike his attacks on Brown.
Scotland is not a "feeble little country". It is a bloody strong country, and hopefully, it will gain the independence it deserves and the right of its people to self-determination.
Scotland currently has the only interesting political, and highly democratic administration in the the United Kingdom.
I am afraid David Starkey is being a bit silly.
Base racism which is very much alive and well in Middle England.
Living where I am, I come across these viraly racist middle englanders. They live in their little English speaking envlaves "aka ghettos" reminiscing about the England they once knew, or whatever they though it was for them.
I don't go to their Hyacinth Bucket dinner parties. I turned enough of them down to be struck off their lists and I don't give a shit for that. In fact I am quietly proud.
In the self obsessed Starkey had said Indian, Pakistani or Black a tonne of shit would have hit him. Remember Carole Thatcher and her private us of the word Golliwog?
Aye, their little Empire has shrunk to be the Celtic Nations and they are pissed off with that.
Feckem, and remember Starkey and his ilk represent the quiet smoldering subliminal racism that has always been abroad in England.
We were only "honorary" English you know, so long as we knew our place.
The mask is slipping and I hope that the people of Scotland actually waken up to Starkey and his audience.
Nicked from a post in Guido
If Starkey had said this about you know who, it would have been fair comment I think.
The AMA diagnostic criteria match very well. I’ve been pointing this out for years and only now are people begining to see this.
A dangerous man for dangerous times… .
AMA DSM-IV Diagnostic criteria for 301.81 Narcissistic Personality Disorder
A pervasive pattern of grandiosity (in fantasy or behavior), need for admiration, and lack of empathy, beginning by early adulthood and present in a variety of contexts, as indicated by five (or more) of the following:
(1) has a grandiose sense of self-importance (e.g., exaggerates achievements and talents, expects to be recognized as superior without commensurate achievements)
(2) is preoccupied with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love
(3) believes that he or she is “special” and unique and can only be understood by, or should associate with, other special or high-status people (or institutions)
(4) requires excessive admiration
(5) has a sense of entitlement, i.e., unreasonable expectations of especially favorable treatment or automatic compliance with his or her expectations
(6) is interpersonally exploitative, i.e., takes advantage of others to achieve his or her own ends
(7) lacks empathy: is unwilling to recognize or identify with the feelings and needs of others
(8) is often envious of others or believes that others are envious of him or her
(9) shows arrogant, haughty behaviors or attitudes
Starkey is GREAT! He's like a petulant child waving his own faecal matter at visiting maiden aunts. Everytime he attacks Scotland in such a manner the vote for Independence goes up. More of the same Dave, he's almost as good as our deep cover agent GB.....Shhhh!
wv gindings
But just think, if the wee treasure had been born 60 miles north he'd be scots. Just our luck.
Faux Cu, if that's what you truly think then I'd be grateful if you will stop following my blog.
GV you said he's actually a good historian. My enlightened English friends say he's not good except in his own area of Henry the fornicator.
I tend to glean my history from dead historians then I can argue to my heart's content.
OR ok, I accept that. Mind you he's got a strange sense of humour. Are all you English like that nowadays? :) :)
WW he was not just a bit silly, he also proved that some English people do think in that way. Many laughed and a few booed. Not one of the English panel said one word, not even the chairman. That's really what caused the depth of insult to the Irish, Welsh and Scots.
FC you have to admire the way the English organised themselves in foreign lands though. I've met many in my years abroad and been invited to the coffee mornings and the like. Only once I accepted because I liked the woman on a one to one basis. Once was enough.
The Scots behave very differently. When I ever found a Scot it was as if they were upset at being discovered.
Have to give the English their due though, when they run Scottish Country Dance clubs the standard of dancing is much higher (and far more serious) than a Scottish one for some reason.
Monty he's dangerous when he appears on the BBC. There are still many in the UK who think the BBC is all great and good but I understand what you mean.
Richard, life does produce small mercies on occasion.
Easy Sub
The convert is always more adherant than those born unto.
Zealots usually are converts.
Or
Where do they speak the "best" English in the UK?
I was always told it was Inverness because English was a foreign language and the Invernessites enunced it carefully.
If that is what you think then I will do so.
I maintain that there is a deep racist streak in meddle class England, not all and not I believe within ordinary working people.
There a lot of the little Englanders in France and many of them I have met, when they get a few drinks or believe that I am one of "them" open up and the racism is unbelievable.
So as I believe in what I have said I will cease to follow your blog.
Please watch it again SR, the audience didn't agree with Starkey. To Faux Cu - please take your name off my blog.
The Lights of Old Aberdeen
GV I admit there were boos, but the people nearest the camera were laughing, perhaps with embarrassment I don't know.
My main point is that in no way did anyone sitting on the panel contradict Starkey, it was never referred to by any of them. The chair at least could have asked him to retract his statement or even ask him if he was trying to be amusing. It was all ignored and that's not the correct way to address matters like this.
I'm not particularly offended, there are people like this of every race, but for it to be condoned (albeit silently) by the panel just isn't right. This is the BBC and we all pay our fair share.
Listening to an independent radio station today the incident was part of the chat. Most English people who phoned in said they were appalled but they had met the odd English person with Starkey's attitude. No doubt there are some Scots with his attitude too, but I'm fortunate insofar as I've never made their acquaintance.
GV please do give further consideration to FC's post. He has written as he has found. Most of us write from our experiences or acquired knowledge don't we? His post was not a personal attack. FC lives abroad and sees the UK rather differently.
Please reconsider your decision, many thanks. I really don't like to think you're so upset by his post to ask him to remove himself as one of your followers.
Jings GV, that brings back memories. When I was young and sillier, I used to think I could sing. When living in Germany we would often have singsongs and the Germans just loved this one for some reason (although I have my doubts many understood all the words). Actually I think the reason was that I sang it with more passion than accuracy once I'd had a few wines :)
Oh happy days.
Faux Cu
for you it seems it really is
........Goodnight Vienna
I've been thrown out of better place and no doubt will be again.
I don't take anything back GV just spat oot the dummy
Having lived abroad, I can say that I agree with FC. Of course they are not all like that, and, there are Scots who are perhaps just as bad. I always think of my Great Aunt who was a military wife, and who, because she lived abroad (Singapore, Italy, Germany) had servants. Well, didn't she think she was Erchy! And did she ever learn a single word of a foriegn language? Not on your life! She came down to earth with a bang when my uncle retired and they had to live in Manchester!
I've always thought of Dr Starkey as being a bit self satisfied and over fond of his own voice. A tad on the silly side too and liable to say stuff designed to shock.
A bit of a twit in fact.
Oh Tris, you did make me smile with 'didn't she think she was Erchy'. Such a long time since I've heard that, a very long time.
Well.... I'm glad... I like making people smile. My gran used to say that about her... I have to admit I didn't really understand it.... Erchy? Why would a woman be Erchy?
Duh....
I'll have to do some research on that tris. Let me get back to you. Anyone else know the saying?
Moridura has taken down the video clip from Youtube for the reasons he explains on his blog:
http://moridura.blogspot.com/2009/04/david-starkey-incident.html
Does Erchy mean getting above themselves
Erch meaning erse?
Aye I think it does mean that FC but the reference to Erchy I thought was to a man called Archie whoever he was. I may well be wrong.
I see that Goodnight Vienna has taken down the video he had on his website with my name on it?
Dear oh dear.
This means nothing to me, Oh Vienna!
Or "Erch" meaning "Arch"... ie something that is over other things maybe?
My gran doesn't know why she said it... it was just a Lochee saying, she thinks.
Thanks for the ideas.
Post a Comment